re: first lord's fury...the same mistake as Robert Jordan?

[Aludra]

For what it's worth, the "out of character-ness" of Kitai's demand and withdrawl from Tavi peaked my curiosity about what had gotten into her, and then later I found out.

I agree that in general, suspending sex from your partner out of spite is completely underhanded and wrong.  

But Tavi reacted in a way appropriate to his character.  After being cornered by two people he respects and deeply cares for, he actually re-thinks his actions with a new perspective and realises how horrible he had been to Kitai in causing her to appear to be a consort instead of his equal in their relationship.  (Because he was doing exactly that.)

So, (as usual for Tavi), he continues on in a rational and methodical plan to rectify his mistake.  He values her so highly that he would divert some of his brain-power to fixing what he messed up.  What exactly is wrong with that?  I'm not of the opinion of the Jedi council that love is a weakness, so to me, Tavi is acting as a very strong man in this particular instance, and not at all becoming a weak-willed man.

I feel a certain amount of pity for a person who doesn't realise that admitting a mistake and fixing it is more valuable than continuing to step on other's feelings (while still being wrong).

[Uilos]

Wow...
w-wow
wow...

That's all I can really say watching this discussion.

Elric (as in Ed and Alphonse?), I have to agree that you're clearly jumping the gun on your assessment. Kitai, who up until now has expressed the Marat mating ritual of "oh hey, there go my clothes" is suddenly demanding to be romanced. The question comes up: What the hell would set her off?

Max, who has the outward morality of Han Solo without the annoying Wookie or Princess to distract him, is a very important clue as to why Kitai is making these demands. If you know Max's past, you'll know precisely why Kitai would go to him of all people about being properly courted.

The character's are consistent throughout the series. Kitai has always found Tavi (all Alerans for that matter) to be somewhat dim. The Characterizations do not shift at all throughout the story.

And your comment about New Readers thinking they're being uncharacteristic makes absolutely no sense in the context you gave. If they've never read it, how do they know it's off?

Not bashing you, I just think you're going on a tear for something that really isn't there

[Shecky P. Waldorf]

the Marat mating ritual of "oh hey, there go my clothes"

I hereby declare this to be MINE.

[elric]

Ok, let me boil this down for you:

Scenario 1: Tavi has 100% focus and no extra romance: 1,000,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/2 of Alera isn't ravaged by the vord.

Scenario 2: Tavi has 50% focus, plus more romance than before: 500,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/4 of Alera isn't ravaged.

That's it.

Pick your scenario.  I pick scenario #1.  And I bet I'm not alone.

[Lord Rae]

How about scenario 3 where Tavi defeats the vord, marries his whore and gets assassinated or ousted within a month of the end of the vord war cause he ignored something fundamental to aleran culture and has been used by the senate as an example of all that is wrong and all that led to their fall to the vord.

You think its not important.

Tavi does. Kitai does. Max Does.

That should be enough for anyone. And it should have made you curious not mad.

[Uilos]

Alright, I'm going to say this, then walk away. Because me and misogyny does not a happy thread make.

One of the main themes of the series is Aleran Society and the problems it creates for itself. All the plotting, backstabbing, infighting. One of the main issues is legitimacy. Bernard and Amara are not allowed to marry because Amara had Blight. Max, despite being just as talented (and thuggish) as his father, is considered a bastard. Tavi is a freak and a social outcast merely because he has no furies of his own. Tavi and Kitai's union in any way, shape, and form is frowned down upon by Alerans due to their raging (though albeit justifiable) xenophobia. The six books of the Codex Alera is the story of how Tavi, with the help of his friends, restructures Aleran Society. First Lord's Fury is essentially the reveal on how he does it all (technologic advancements, making sure his family future is safe, peace with the canim, etc, etc, etc)

Also, the books thread seems to be forcing Tavi to acknowledge the role of First Lord and all that it means. Kitai realizes this from the offstart, but Tavi doesn't. This is because he spent the good portion of his life raising sheep in the back of beyond. By the end of the series, Tavi has gone by the name Rufus Scipio longer than he has Gaius Octavian, which is his birth name. Kitai's outburst, and Max's support of said outburst, ties all the way back to him acknowledging not just his Name, but the baggage that being Gaius entails.

[Shecky P. Waldorf]

Ok, let me boil this down for you:

Scenario 1: Tavi has 100% focus and no extra romance: 1,000,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/2 of Alera isn't ravaged by the vord.

Scenario 2: Tavi has 50% focus, plus more romance than before: 500,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/4 of Alera isn't ravaged.

That's it.

Pick your scenario.  I pick scenario #1.  And I bet I'm not alone.

And the point of the entire series is that it's NOT that simple. If it were, the series would be one thin book long, because Sextus WAS Scenario 1. Let me know how that turned out.

[matorade]

Ok, let me boil this down for you:

Scenario 1: Tavi has 100% focus and no extra romance: 1,000,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/2 of Alera isn't ravaged by the vord.

Scenario 2: Tavi has 50% focus, plus more romance than before: 500,000 out of 2,000,000 Aleran's survive the vord, and 1/4 of Alera isn't ravaged.

That's it.

Pick your scenario.  I pick scenario #1.  And I bet I'm not alone.

God I can't imagine I would read FLF that excluded your so-called distractions and, as shecky said, it would be hell a thin book.  And I also disagree with your "logical" posts:

1. If there were no distractions, as you think there should be, then Tavi would think something like "It's all on me, it's all on me and it's all on me" all way from Canea to final battle, the pressure could mount up on him to crack up which doesn't sound healthy to me.  He is a human not Lt. Commander Data.  That's what the so-called distractions are important to be there for his sake.

2. To remind him his love, friends and family are there for him to the end
3. To remind him there's something to look forward after the final battle if he makes it or give him an incentive to double his efforts against the vord.

4. Keep him sane by think about other things than "It's all on me, it's all on me and it's all on me" thought.

5. Allow him to resolve any unfinished issues/business and be content about them before about facing the end of world.  Hell I would bet you that Gaius Sextus died a heartbroken one because he knew he would never get a chance to resolve any unfinished business/issues with his grandson, Isana and even several people or get some grandfather-grandson moments.

6. Excluded your so-called distractions from the  book, hell, then the majority readers would complain ALOT and badger Jim for these unresolved so-called distractions constantly!

[nthnclls]

Mmm. Use of the word "lame" except in it's definition of "having a sore or injured foot" is a major turn-off for me and I tend to tune out those who use "lame" as a descriptive in it's current adolescent slang definition.

It's lame to not accept all the current uses of the word lame.

[plas]

first time poster and this IS my favorite series ever btw lol.  Im male and i LOVE the fact that butch has given katai a background. u have to remeber shes not aelaren and could really care less about much of thier life and meanings.  The biggest thing imho isnt the fact that tavi has "treated her wrong' its because she DOES understand that if they are victorious then if her and tavi dont go about thier love life correct then the council will fight tavi and his claim on the throne.  Butcher has not only made her a irreplacable  character of this amazing series he has made her the only thing he could.  A lover and friend that tavi is in need of that can shut him up and be his equal in all aspects. Finish the books man thier amazing.

[KismetKat]

elric - you have the wrong end of the stick entirely. In fact it worries me just where your head must be at to come up with the conculsions that you have 

[Priscellie]

elric - you have the wrong end of the stick entirely. In fact it worries me just where your head must be at to come up with the conculsions that you have 

Oy, no getting personal.  It's fine to disagree with someone's ideas, but turning that into a personal insult is not appropriate here.

[Matrix Refugee (formerly Morraeon)]

It's lame to not accept all the current uses of the word lame.

I prefer not to argue with people who use terms that make them sound like twelve-years being snotty to their elders (referring to the OP, not you).

[Priscellie]

I prefer not to argue with people who use terms that make them sound like twelve-years being snotty to their elders (referring to the OP, not you).

Speaking of inappropriate personal insults...

[KismetKat]

Oy, no getting personal.  It's fine to disagree with someone's ideas, but turning that into a personal insult is not appropriate here.

Sorry Pris - didn't intend it as a personal insult. The OPs reading of the narrative and didactic defence of it in spite of good explanations seriously did cause me some concerns.

But if you need to then please delete my post and those related to it.